By LARRY VAUGHT
Dick Vitale has never been shy voicing his opinions, and he wasn’t recently when he told Kentucky coach John Calipari he didn’t think he could win a national championship by having to “reload†his roster every year as he’s doing again this year at Kentucky.
“I have debated with John and have told him this and he could prove me wrong. I don’t think you can win national championship with a reloading of the roster year after year. You can win a lot of games as he did last year with talent that was outstanding as we are seeing now in the NBA,†said the ESPN analyst during a conference call Tuesday. “But I really believe when you in the NCAA Tournament and get to the Sweet Sixteen and Elite Eight and those teams are maybe as good of teams and certainly have experienced winning talent.
“Kentucky has talent again with Brandon Knight, Terrence Jones and others. I think they will win a lot of games. But I do not think they can win a national title.â€Â
ESPN analyst Jay Bilas noted that coaches need talent to win, but pointed out that most coaches would prefer talented juniors and seniors rather than super talented freshmen like UK had last year and does again this year. He noted that older players know more about how to play and are physically and emotionally more mature.
“That’s why older mid-majors teams are so hard to beat (in the NCAA). They are so experienced and understand what is going on and how to come to work every day and how to take care of themselves,†Bilas said.
“I was amazed at how well Kentucky did last year even with its super talent. They are so young this year again and are starting over. That’s a hard way to play. For them to win 34 or 35 games like they did last year was remarkable,†Bilas said. “For this year’s team to match what last year’s team accomplished would be extraordinary. I do not think that could even be expected.â€Â
Vitale said Calipari quickly disagreed with his analysis about a talented young team being able to win a national title.
“Obviously he is going to disagree. He thinks one thing  win, win, win. He has done an incredible job.â€Â
31 Responses to Vitale: Cal can’t win title with “reloaded” rosters
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I guess Vitale missed Florida winning the title with 4 sophomore’s and a junior. And of those 4 most of them got very little playing time as freshmen. And more importantly, they were not as talented down the line as UK was last year. He also must have missed the presence of a guy named Patterson along with some other guys named Stevenson, Harris and Miller not to mention Liggins. UK actually had quite a bit of experience last year. They just had a hard time getting playing time because of the talented freshmen.
But then Vitale never turns down a chance to bash UK no matter what. I wonder if he was screaming about how great the state of NC was while making his statements? I wonder if he still thinks no coach should go to UK for any reason? I wonder if he’s made any more commercials slobbering about how great NC is? Vitale is no friend of UK. I loved the treatment the ESPN reporter, Mark Schlabach, got during his “visit” to Auburn to investigate the Cam story. That’s how people like that should be greeted everywhere IMO and that includes Vitale.
As much as I really dislike Vitale, and I really do not like anything about the guy, I tend to agree with him on this on one important level. John Calipari is plowing new ground with his recruiting approach, and I believe he understands that at UK the measure of success is the number of banners he hangs during his tenure. At least he has said as much. If his gamble on recruiting pays off for him, he will leave a legacy at UK that may only be exceeded by Coach Rupp, and if he fails, he will be known for winning games, but not hanging any banners.
I think it is the great unanswered question, and I believe it is fair game to talk about it. It is not time to conclude that it can’t be done, or that Calipari will not get it done. But, at the least, the jury is still out on the question, and until Calipari finishes another 3 seasons, without a championship, it will be too soon to conclude that he won’t. However, after the 4th year, it will be that he either needs to get one, or answer the question.
Dicky Vitalis, bet that is why he lost his hair, used too much of it, is another one of those media types I would like to run into the Atlantic Ocean, north of Main, in January! He has a tattoo of puke on his behind and one of their coach over his heart. He also has a picture of C. Laettner on the ceiling above his bed. Even if I ever agreed with him I would never admit it and I just happen not to agree with the old grease ball on this one. I can’t stand to listen to him when he calls a game, I turn the sound off and just play it by ear since the radio is not in sync with the games any longer. If closed caption works, I use that. I don’t understand why Dicky Vitalis is in the hall of fame and Joe B is not. Makes no sense to me. GO CATS! FREE ENES, PLEASE! SOMEONE get Josh his own poster! Neuter Thamel!
You may dislike Vitale, but he has been nothing but supportive of Calipari and UK. And he’s right. UK cant have a mass exodus to the NBA every year and expect to win championships. Yes there have been exceptions like the Florida team, but they werent freshmen who are experiencing everything for the first. Yeah last year’s team had some experience, but this year’s team has even less. This team is goin to be a really good offensive team, and shooting alone can win us ball games. But, they have to learn to play defense. That is what college is about, teaching kids how to play defense. If they listen to Cal, play defense, hustle, hit the boards hard, and never take a play off…they very easily could prove Vitale wrong. Here’s to hoping they do. Go Cats!
Shhh…don’t tell anyone Beth, I agree with you, just didn’t want to put it in print about Vitalis.
I gotta agree with Vitales comment,if coach cal going to hang banners up to the rafters he needs to keep some key players longer than one or two years.
Hard not to agree after last year’s team did win and look at the talent it had. But if anyone can pull it off, it will be cal. Still say 2011-12 could be UK’s year
All of this will be a moot point shortly. The one-and-done thing is going to come to an end one way or another this summer, when the NBA renegotiates the CBA. Either the kids will be forced to stay several years or they will again be able to go straight out of high school. Either way, Cal will be able to build a little more stability into his recruiting. He will have the opportunity to keep kids for more than a year. THAT is when things will really start to get interesting.
It’s hard to disagree with what Vitale said. Experience is a big factor in any championship run. Even Florida’s teams had the players there for more than one year. It’s also hard to disagree with Cal’s success either, but he doesn’t have any banners to his name yet, so the jury is still out.
It’s not Cal’s fault that things are the way they are. Is he supposed to turn these top rated players down? I don’t think so. So let’s just enjoy what he is doing for us.
IN CAL WE TRUST!!
GO BIG BLUE!!!!
I forgot to add…My thoughts and prayers are with Eloy and his family. I hope he finds some comfort in this terribly time.
My thoughts are also with Eloy and his family.
Again I think Florida came very close to winning with 1st year players that were not on the level as last years first year UK player. I looked it up once and that bunch of soph’s got a very small amount of minutes the year they were freshmen. No matter though. The whole lay of the landscape has changed dramatically with the one year rule and it will likely change again. We have exactly one year of experience to draw on i.e. the one year rule and how it affects the game. I’d be careful making too many conclusions based on such a small sample. And again UK was not that young last year. Stevenson and Harris had 3 years of experience and they were decent ball players. Miller had a year and Patterson had two great years. That’s 9 years of experience on the team even though many of those players rarely got PT last year. 9 years is more experience than Florida had when they won it all. I just saw this all broken down on another board although they ignored half of UK’s bench when they figured up the totals.
The thing is do we really expect Cal to have all of his freshment to go pro ever ear? How many times has that ever happened? One is the answer to that. And it was last year. I dont’ expect to see 5 first round draft picks every spring coming from UK. We could see guys like Kanter stick around long enough to get his degree considering the value his parents put on education. We could see several players not make the big jump to NBA level talent in one year. We could see players looking like they made a mistake going pro too early.
I don’t see so many bad things brewing for Cal and the Cats at all. I just don’t expect a repeat of last year’s draft success every year.
Look for more players to stick around and maybe even for less players to sign every year. One bad year can spoil a run like the one Cal is on. I see Cal making this work in one way or another despite the doom and gloom predictions of a guy who has a long history of bashing UK. Guys he told coaches to stay away from UK because of the fans. If that isn’t bashing UK I don’t know what is. If you don’t believe me watch this video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UZPJQrHsIng That’s the worst case of bashing I’ve ever seen. He thinks anyone who wins as much as he did is a great coach. Wrong. He didn’t do anything at all. He has never been a coach at a top program but he wants to think of himself as a top coach. He isn’t in that category despite what he thinks.
BTW how has Smith done at Minn.? Read this article and you’ll get a clue.
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/354007-should-minnesota-gopher-coach-tubby-smith-be-on-the-hot-seat
Read the criticisms about Smith in particular. They’ve had too many off court issues, they can’t run a half court offense, and they can’t get out of the second level of teams. Wow does that bring back memories. They’re already trying to get rid of Smith in Minn.. There’s talk of him moving on to Ga. Tech. Smith is going to ride the wave of his one successful year for the rest of his career and each year proves more and more he won with players Pitino taught to play. Yet Vitale hasn’t backed down one iota from what he said about UK. I wonder why he isn’t bashing MN for being hard on Tubby? There’s no national campaign to support Smith now. That only happened because they wanted Smith at UK so UK would continue to be a second rate team (just like the article said – I didn’t write it – I just know what they’re going through).
Like him or not he is RIGHT!
on the surface, i (shudder) agree with dickie v. at the same time, we have never seen Cal + UK ever. Cal + Memphis/UMass just isnt the same. i’m not unconvinced that the kind of kids Cal gets here cant win it all. we just havent seen enough yet to decide.
that being said, we need more Pats and Millers because history just says you dont win without some experienced players.
now, that being said, everyone acts like we will be making 1/6 of the draft every yr. we wont. we will have 2/3 yr guys. Cal always has and we should this yr as well. he just needs more time.
Love the comments here
@King, just watched the video and read the story. I wonder what old Dicky Vitalis is going to say about Minn. and how they are talking about Tubby now? I always liked Tubby as a man, mentor, role model and family man, but he wore out his welcome. The program got stagnant, dull and boring in his last 4 years. He won a ring with players recruited by someone else. The off court issues aside, it looks like his style hasn’t changed and the Gopher fans are in the same seat we were 4 years ago. Hopefully, Tubby will leave gracefully and not in the same manner he left Kentucky. I thought it was a little sneaky the manner in which he left. I lost a little respect for him then as a man. It was good to watch that video and be reminded of every hateful word he said about Kentucky and the BBN. It just renews and intensifies my lack of respect for old Vitalis. GO CATS! FREE ENES, PLEASE! Someone get Josh his own poster! Neuter Thamel and maybe add Vitalis to the list are at least get some superglue for his lips.
Vitale was mad about Tubby being ran out by the fans, and with all the non-sense that went on, who came blame him? Tubby is a great person. But he also realizes how passionate our fans are and he knows that unless you are recruiting at the top level and competing for championships, it doesnt matter how nice a guy you are. That’s why he loves Calipari at UK because its a match made in heaven. Yeah we may have had more experience last year, but Stevenson and Harris did not log many minutes a game. They were beneficial at times when we did need that veteran leadership. But we had 3 freshmen in the line up last year just like we do this year. Youth is an issue when you are figuring out how to play at the college level. And Miller and Liggins arent the most vocal guys i nthe world either, they have to step it up. This young team is just yearning to learn and you can see when Cal talks to them on the court, they listen and soak up every word. Cal can maybe do what is rarely done, but leadership is pivotal. These guys are talents enough to win it all, they just gotta work hard. And I agree with Larry, I have almost all but guaranteed a title for next year. If Knight and Jones stick around with next years class, there is no way they dont win unless somethin drastic happens.
Smith was not a good fit at UK. He was dragging the program down with the constant turmoil on the team and his slow style of basketball and really shaky half court offense. No one should complain because fans expect to win. That’s what separates UK from every other school. They not only expect to win, they demand it. And when the winning comes they will support the team like mad.
I don’t believe he had such a huge amount of respect for Smith. Why isn’t he complaining now that MN fans are trying to run Smith off and they are. I also don’t agree that he was such a good man. That was propaganda put out by the national press to try to pressure UK to keep him on. Where is that pressure now? Let’s look at some of the things Smith did. First he repeatedly blamed his trouble with UK fans on racism. I wonder why we don’t dislike Joker? Smith even went as far as buying up commercial time on tv stations around the south (but not in Lexington) saying he wanted to be judged by his character instead of the color of his skin. Say WHAT? Why did he do that? He did it to make people hate UK. He did it to hurt UK recruiting because he already knew his career there was over. This happened a few weeks before the end of his last season. He did it to sabotage the program that paid him millions and millions of dollars. He blamed the fans for his lack of success. Yeah right. I wonder why Cal doesn’t have that problem? That was far from the first time he blamed racism for his problems. But it was the most egregious. Why else did he do that? I have part of the video of that commercial if anyone wants to see it. I have the crucial part. Why spend your own money on commercial time on tv stations throughout the south? That was astoundingly low.
Smith also never took the blame for anything that went wrong ever. That’s not what a man with good character does. Cal takes the blame for things all the time. All coaches do or at least the vast majority do. Smith was all the time saying horrible things about the players. No coach should ever do that.
I hate to open up old wounds here but Vitale just really rubs me the wrong way. I’m not the only one either. He’s had armed guards follow him in Lexington over things he’s said before. At least that’s the reports I’ve seen.
If you think Vitale isn’t prejudiced against Kentucky take a look at his slobbering love affair commercial about North Carolina. Notice he mentions his beloved teams, Duke and UNC. This is not a man without bias.
http://youtube.com/watch?v=453iCUDjgG8&feature=related
Compare that video to what he said about Kentucky and tell me there isn’t a huge difference.
My dislike of everything Vitale began long before the Tubby wars at UK. I dislike the way he turns college basketball into a three ring circus, his incessant love affair with anything Duke and Coach K related. and the list goes on and on. However, if any UK fan can tolerate this hypocrite after the ugly things he had to say about UK fans during and after the Tubby wars, then forgive me but that fan should reexamine allegiances and decide whether they are really UK fans or simply Tubby Smith fans.
I supported Tubby Smith for several years during his time here. I wrote extensively in his defense in the face of harsh criticism from many of my friends who had already concluded that Tubby Smith was not the right man to lead UK Basketball because of non-stop turmoil, style of play, and increasing patterns of recruiting failures and disappointments. As all of you either know or should know by now, I form my opinions about basketball [and football] teams based on their objective performance measures, and I have tracked and monitored those measures for UK basketball teams since the early 1990s on a game by game, season by season basis. The data finally became undeniable.
During the Tubby Smith era at UK:
1. The pace of play was steadily decreasing. The pace declined in the first year under Smith from the average pace established by the 1990s Pitino teams. However, thereafter, the pace continue to decline on an annual basis until at the end it was in the mid 60s range, which is well below the NCAA D1 average pace in college basketball. Despite the hard facts about pace, each fall, Tubby promised to play at a faster pace, only to see the actual pace decline yet again. This factor alone is the primary reason UK fans did not get to watch the true talents of a Rajon Rondo emerge during his time wearing the blue and white.
2. The general consensus has been that Tubby Smith is a “great defensive coach” but the facts simply do not support that point of view. The facts are that UK’s defensive efficiency deteriorated throughout his UK tenure. The defensive efficiency fell by a substantial amount from 1997 to 1998 [Tubby's first year] and it continued to deteriorate throughout the remaining 9 years while he was at UK. I don’t care how a coach teaches defense, or what he names or calls his scheme. I only care about the results, and the facts are clear that Tubby Smith’s UK teams did not achieve the results on the defensive end of the court.
3. During Tubby Smith’s tenure, nearly 50% of the players he recruited, signed, and coached left the program with eligibility remaining, but not to move to the next level. This exodus of players occurred from the beginning, and never really ended over the 10 years. Since the exodus was not to move into the NBA the exodus not only hurt the program by constantly having to replace players that would have some experience with players with none, and the exodus eventually worked against UK on the recruiting trails.
4. During the latter years that Tubby Smith was at UK, his recruiting for UK fell off the map. Some say he simply found the recruiting process the required lots of travel and dealing with the AAU circuit folks distasteful. Some say the top flight recruits did not want to play what was clear to them a very slow, plodding style of basketball that UK was playing at that time. I believe that some of both factors contributed, and it is clear that UK’s recruiting was left hoping to pick up some left over crumbs each and every Spring after the likes of UNC, Duke, Kansas, Louisville, Indiana, …. had helped themselves to their servings at the recruiting table.
5. As a result of all of the above, by the time that Tubby had worn out his welcome here, UK was not a feared opponent anymore, within the SEC or anywhere else in the land. The record speaks for itself in this regard, just as the record speaks for the other points I have already made.
6. In all of his years as a head coach, Tubby Smith has never recruited, signed, and coached a single player into a final four. Yes, the 1998 team included Saul, but he did not recruit Saul, Saul simply came along for the ride.
In 2006, I finally reached the conclusion that Tubby Smith would never take UK back to a final four, and concluded that UK needed to make a change. Everyone who knows me, knows that I came to that conclusion only after long and troubling deliberations and based on the “numbers” that my critics so despise. Yet, the Tubby Smith supporters pulled the race card on me, as they had done before with anyone who dared speak against the man’s record. They tried to disrupt and damage my business. They tried to have me fired from the UK faculty. Yet, not once did a single Tubby Smith supporter refute my facts, nor did they offer other facts that could withstand scrutiny in support of the man’s record at UK.
I did not think Tubby Smith deserved that “one more year” that the UK Administration was determined to allow, and the record in that “one more year” was more dismal, and set this program back further. When he finally ran away to catch that bird to Minnesota after that “one more year” ended, he did so without the courage, or common courtesy, of speaking with the players he left behind, and he left the UK cupboard essentially bare of talent.
I am glad he is gone. Coach Calipari clearly is restoring UK’s aura and has returned UK’s recruiting to the level that every player of any quality worth noting wants to get one of those special offers from Coach Calipari to play basketball for UK again. UK is again in the discussion, and in the hunt.
Dick Vitale during the 9 months that I spoke publicly for Tubby Smith’s removal also attacked me personally in his columns, on the radio, and on the TV by name. Now he wants to jump at the front of UK’s parade and act as if he is a great friend of UK and the UK Fan base.
Not a chance Dick Vitale.
Sorry for the rant, but the posting in this thread, both pro Tubby and anti-Tubby, prompted my long response.
King and Prof. You two said everything I wanted to say but was afraid to because of the social aspect attached to his tenure at UK. Every year after the ’98 season things kept going down hill. As you noted, he couldn’t or else wouldn’t recruit. What made me mad was how he kept Saul as the starting PG and would hardly ever take him out. Until his senior year he didn’t pass a lot. He would come across the mid-court line, either rush the basket or try for a three and then it was up to the other 4 players to try to get a basket. I was glad when he left, sorry it didn’t work out, but he just wasn’t a right fit as you guys said. GO CATS! FREE ENES, PLEASE! ETC. ETC.
Professor, remember those days well when Vitale blasted you. Understand your feelings. I do agree with Dicky V. on this, but then again Cal may prove him wrong. This year, to me, it all just comes down to how much Kanter gets to play
Larry,
Whether Dick Vitale is right or wrong about Calipari’s ability to win championships with a boat load of one and done players remains to be seen. I have my concerns about that strategy too, and have expressed those concerns for well over a year. However, I am not yet convinced that Calipari can’t get it done that way. I also agree in concept that seeing 5 kids leave early each year for the NBA is not likely. However, look at this year. Potentially, Miller could leave early. Liggins is less likely, but could leave early. Knight could leave early. Jones could leave early. And if Kanter could play, Kanter could leave early. That is 5 potential early exits again in 2011 to the NBA from this team.
I do not believe that 5 will leave early, but I do believe that 3 are likely. If I had to name names now, my three likely to go would be Kanter, Miller, and Jones. I believe Knight may stay a second year if his degree is within reach, but if the lure of the NBA is strong enough, he could make it 4 this year.
Assuming no change in NBA policy, is there any reason to believe that 3 or 4 players from the 2012 roster won’t be tempted to test those water as well.
I have said that the loss of 3 or more players early on an annual basis places such a high burden on sustained recruiting that the team will be forever young, freshman dominated, and eventually unsustainable UNLESS Calipari can demonstrate that the system will produce the banners that the fans demand.
Even if Dick Vitale is right on this point, that does not move him into a position of greater or lesser esteem for this member of the Big Blue Nation.
Linda,
The attacks against those who dared to speak out against Tubby Smith were vile, and certain to occur. That was part of the strategy to keep the UK faithful in line. Fear is a powerful motivator.
Fear not, Linda, and we all know that you really don’t fear speaking the truth, as we have all witnessed here at Vaught’s Views.
It is safe to speak the truth about Tubby Smith.
The Minnesota fans are learning this as well. However, they too are contending with the vile attacks from the Tubby Mafia when they dare to speak up, but as time passes, and as Tubby establishes his own clear record of mediocrity at Minnesota just as he did at UK, there will be more and more of the Gopher fans willing to take the heat and speak the truth there. It is already happening, and Tubby is just beginning his 4th year at Minnesota.
It will be interesting to see if he, and Saul, can survive to see a 5th anniversary of his flight from the Bluegrass to the Tundra.
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Some great comments here. I am new around here. I only learned of and started reading the site a few months ago and finally decided to make a comment. I only partially agree with the sentiment that Cal will not win a title with a mass of reloading each year. I agree that it is probably harder than it is for people with experienced and developed talent, but not impossible.
I don’t think we will have 5 players leave every year. This year I would say the possibilities of people leaving are limited to Kanter, Knight and Jones. I don’t believe Miller or Liggins will be gone. Neither will see even close to the interest that Patterson did as a junior. They will be back as seniors. Lockout or not, I’m not even sure Knight or Jones will leave, Jones being the most likely to go. And I think barring a lockout Kanter is a lock to be gone. Of course I don’t have any insider information, just going on intuition and guesswork.
If that scenario plays out then UK will be a force to be reckoned with next year. But, we also wouldn’t have fully reloaded with talent and if the title is won, it wouldn’t really prove the theory correct.
Just my two cents on the situation. And lastly, to TheProfessor, I’m sorry to hear about your dealings with Vitale. I am not a fan either as I believe he’s a popularity whore, but let’s hope he’s wrong here!
Quash, glad to have you with us. And I think you could be exactly right about next year
Professor, thank you! I’m just glad that it is being proven that it is the coaching and not the BBN that was the reason why the program hit rocky bumps going down hill. Glad other people feel the same! GO CATS! FREE ENES, PLEASE! Someone get Josh his own poster! NEUTER THAMEL! Duct tape vitalis’ mouth!
i think dickie v is just upset that kids dont redshirt and play for 5 yrs while wearing short shorts, shooting set jump shots and running the weave.
Anyone that doesn’t agree with this is just in denial. It is a fact that you can’t win National Championships reloading every year. Its not that hard to disagree and get support on a site that is 100% Kentucky Wildcats, but when you have 5, yes 5 guys that went in the first round of the NBA draft and you could not even make a Final Four, what excuse can you give? In 2010 , lack of competition in schedule…well, yes, but it wasn’t the worst I’ve seen, still around 20th SOS. Was it coaching? I shouldn’t have been. Cal is not the best coach in the world but he’s gone to a few final fours. What else can it be? Yes, young players. You can understand struggling early against a terrible Miami team or a bad UNC team, but by the end of the year, you should be ready to roll. It comes down to being young. UK won’t win this year with their team and can only hope their guys stick around for more than 2 years. If that would have happened last year, UK would be looking at a national championship for the next 3 years, but still might struggle to get there in 2011. Only time will tell, but if the revolving door continues, no new banners will be in Lexington any time soon.
That’s pretty funny Nashville
A couple more three’s and a few free throws a last year’s Kiddie Cats would have been in the Final Four. UK just had a bad game, that’s all. Guard play wins championships. That’s why I like UK’s chances this year and love their chances next year with Knight and Teague playing the 1 and 2 positions.
I’m not sure that this team will be as good as last years team, we will miss the experience that Patterson gave us for sure, but some of our returning players may surprise too.
I think last years team should have won the whole thing, the game they lost was a real fluke to me, especially the three point shooting. But it is hard to believe this team will be as talented as that team, FIVE high draft picks.